Marketing For Women’s Health Professionals with Allie Chandler

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:00:03 Hi and welcome to the Integrative Women’s Health Podcast. I’m your host, Doctor Jessica Drummond, and I am so thrilled to have you here. As we dive into today’s episode, as always innovating and integrating in the world of women’s health. And just as a reminder, the content in this podcast episode is no substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment from your medical or licensed health care team. While myself and many of my guests are licensed healthcare professionals, we are not your licensed healthcare professionals, so you want to get advice on your unique circumstances. Diagnostic recommendations treatment recommendations from your home medical team. Enjoy the episode. Let’s innovate and integrate together. Hi there. Welcome back to the Integrative Women’s Health Podcast. I’m your host, Doctor Jessica Drummond, and I am thrilled to have Allie Chandler on with us today. If you are a women’s health or wellness practitioner who is struggling with getting clients, marketing, marketing systems, lead generation, conversion strategies, maybe you’re shifting from a brick and mortar practice to going online, or adding hybrid digital coaching services or group programs.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:01:32 You have got to listen to this episode. We’re going to get into, like, all kinds of things that we teach in the perimenopause menopause certificate about your voice, your messaging, using AI, and when not to use AI, even if you never take any of our courses, ever. Listen to this episode and know that this is exactly how I teach this stuff because it’s so important. And Allie Chandler is the master. She works for so many, really. I mean, some of the people I respect the absolute most in the industry of functional health, functional nutrition, nervous system regulation, microbiome health. She works with really high quality people that absolutely know what they’re doing, and she has some really useful insights about how you’re messaging, how you show up actually changes your patient outcomes because of the clients you’re attracting, how long they work with you, their commitment to you, your commitment to them. So without further ado, let me quickly introduce Ali. She is the CEO of Upsell Health. She specializes in helping integrative and functional medicine professionals as well as wellness brands elevate their voice and their reach through intentional, soul aligned marketing.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:02:59 She has her own personal journey of healing, which I think is so important because she wanted to take her story and actually help market the kinds of integrative and evidence based practitioners that are excellent in the field. And, you know, one of the things we talk about in this episode is the reality is it’s sometimes the case that the the people with the most clinical coaching excellence, skill, ability are not the best marketers in the space. And some of the best marketers aren’t. You know, the ones you want to see. You probably already know that. But this excellence is being hidden. So she is going to teach you how to find your voice in this space that can feel crowded if like you just have gotten into this and you look around and you’re like, oh my gosh, there’s already someone in my area working on perimenopause who has 900 000 followers. Like, how am I even going to begin? So she helps using a very specific quiz that we’re going to talk about in the episode, and she helps you learn your own voice, because you don’t need 900,000 clients to have a very, very successful practice.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:04:23 And your clients don’t always need you to have 900,000 clients. They need you to utilize your skill, your depth of holding space, your coaching skills, your intuition to help them get their best results. They’re not looking for the most famous person. They’re looking for the person who knows their stuff and cares about them the most. So listen to this episode and I’ll see you on the other side. Hi Ali, thank you so much for being here. I’m thrilled to be interviewing you. We have communicated for years now by email and through different collaborations, and that’s one of your deep skill sets is helping practitioners communicate and collaborate. But before we get into all of that, which I think is going to be so valuable for our community, I’d love to talk a little bit about your personal history and why you decided to use your marketing skills in the world of health and integrative health based on your deeply personal healing journey with mold toxicity, with Lyme disease, with Pots. How does that inform the work that you do.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:05:50 And why is that sort of part of your motivation?

Allie Chandler 00:05:54 Yeah, definitely. It fully is the reason why I’m in the career I’m in now. I was a high school teacher. It is my background. So that’s when I started right after college. That’s what I was doing. And after maybe 3 or 4 years, I decided I didn’t like it anymore and I wanted to change careers. And before I did that, I decided to take a backpacking trip through Europe. And that’s where this whole health journey started. We were backpacking in the Swiss Alps, and overnight I got a whole bunch of bug bites. And then the next day I was like, I can’t my my brain’s not working like I can’t walk, right? My heart’s racing. I have all these digestive issues and anxiety and things that I never had before. It truly was an overnight, like a light switch went off and for about ten years I struggled with that, and just understanding what was going on took me about four years to realize that it was.

Allie Chandler 00:06:50 Lyme disease was a big contributing factor, but as we all know, it’s not typically just one thing. So there’s a lot of things going on. But I got into the industry because I had this ten year journey of figuring out how to heal myself when a lot of the more conventional routes weren’t really helping me. And so I dove into functional medicine and tried a whole bunch of different practitioners and protocols, and I learned about drainage and parasite cleanses and all of the things that I wasn’t familiar with before. And so out of this, I actually created my business while I was still sick. I never stopped working, even though for a couple of years I was completely bed bound with hyper adrenergic pots, and I really couldn’t even walk to my mailbox for a few years. I certainly could not enter a store because my nervous system was just every light and sound, and crowd was way too much for me at the time. And so this business came out of all of this because I was working with some supplement companies and working with practitioners within that, and then practitioners started saying, hey, I see what you’re doing for Cell Core and Microbiome Labs.

Allie Chandler 00:07:59 Do you do your own marketing? So I ended up leaving and branching off and doing my own thing, but I definitely would not be in this career at all had I not gone through many years of trauma. And I do think it’s helpful because for practitioners that I work with, I’ve been the patient, I’ve been their ideal avatar. So I understand a lot more about messaging in the functional medicine space than if you just were to have any copywriter come in who doesn’t have the deep experience as being sick, and also being in this industry and doing all of that research. I’m really grateful now to be feeling so much better and being able to give back to the people who were like me ten years ago and didn’t know where to turn.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:08:39 Absolutely. And you and I have a similar philosophy that as these practitioners become more skilled, they really dedicate true excellence to their craft that helps them become more confident in their marketing, but vice versa. Sometimes we have to do these two things collaboratively. We need to get comfortable and practiced and skilled in the marketing, because this is our 110th ish episode.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:09:08 So there’s a practice to being on camera, to speaking publicly, to being on social media that can feel really uncomfortable for people at first. So when your clients are struggling to communicate online, how do you help them overcome that disconnect? Even if you maybe you worked with them as a patient, that their skills are excellent. Like, how do they get comfortable sharing that message? Because I think one of the challenges in functional medicine is and actually all health care is that often not the absolute best practitioners are the best marketers. And that’s a problem. That’s a real problem. Yeah, it’s so true.

Allie Chandler 00:09:50 Yeah, I think I see that quite frequently. And a lot of the reason is because many practitioners don’t have a marketing background, which is understandable. You’re spending a lot of your time learning your craft, which is healing people and getting all of that training. So we shouldn’t expect you to be great marketers. And maybe there’s a little bit of that self-confidence with, I don’t know what I’m doing.

Allie Chandler 00:10:13 I see all of these other practitioners growing really big on Instagram, and they’re having these email lists and doing summits and doing all of these things. And I think a lot of practitioners feel behind and they feel I can never do that. And for example, if somebody wants to specialize in mold or Lyme disease, they’re looking at competitors and saying, well, I’m never going to get 900 000 followers like this practitioner, I might as well not even start. And that is so not the case. I feel like everybody’s voice and their experience is so important. So a lot of what I’m doing, there’s two things that I do right away with practitioners. The first one is we identify their ideal avatar because if you don’t know who you’re speaking to, your messaging is going to be so broad or it’s not going to make sense, and you won’t be attracting the right patients, and you’re going to have this disconnect of all of these people might be applying to work with me, but I don’t work with whatever root causes that they’re coming in with.

Allie Chandler 00:11:12 I’m not a great fit for that. So we do a lot of deep dive into avatar work, and maybe we identify 2 to 3 that they want to focus on. And we go really deep into like psychographic and demographic information. My favorite question to ask is what is your ideal patient googling at 3 a.m.? What’s keeping them up at night that they can’t figure out about their own health? So we do a lot of those exercises and I feel like that helps practitioners understand more who they’re speaking to because I’m like, okay. Think of this avatar. When you’re writing a social post, you’re talking one on one to this person. You know, their pain points. You know what they’re trying to figure out. So that gives them a little bit of clarity in the messaging. The second thing that I love doing is helping them identify their own voice. And I do that through this archetype system. I have 15 different sort of buckets, practitioner voices where they can start, right. It’s not perfect, but it’s at least putting them into a lane.

Allie Chandler 00:12:11 So for example, one of them is a rebel disruptor. So this person loves going after myth busting. And nobody’s told you this. And here’s a secret about healing from like thyroid conditions that nobody’s told you. Or they might be a mystic cosmic. So that person is really heavy on the mind, body, spirit and emotional side. So they might be sharing more things along that line. But those two in combination, I think, give practitioners the confidence to say like, even though I don’t know, strategy and I couldn’t tell you like marketing terms specifically, at least my voice and my message is solid. I know who I’m talking to, and I know who I am as a practitioner and what my voice sounds like, and I feel like that’s enough. Like you don’t have to have the technical marketing background if you understand your avatar and your own voice.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:13:04 Yeah. So let’s say a person identifies their own voice as being more mystical or spiritual. How do you help them practice that? Because I think one of the big fears I see is that our students will have some understanding of their voice, some pretty strong understanding of their avatar, but then they feel like it has to be perfect.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:13:25 They have to be scripted. It feels hard to do the iterative work of just the messy piece, where they’re going to be going out in public. Maybe only ten people are going to see it, but that still can feel scary. Yeah.

Allie Chandler 00:13:40 Yeah. So my favorite tip that I always suggest people do is they actually record voice memos of themselves answering specific questions. So I’ve had for myself for my business even I generated like 100 different questions that I wanted to answer about why I do what I do, like what’s important to me, what is my philosophy on things. And then whenever I have a chance, I’ll just get on my iPhone. I’ll record my voice, my answer to it, grab the transcript. And then typically what I’ll do is I also, for myself, have a like an ideal brand voice document of writing that I’ve done. No AI like me actually writing in my own voice and tone and then putting the two together so you can take an answer that you voice memos, which is a great time saver, because I know we’re all so busy And then you can run it through, like if you do use AI or if you have the time to do it yourself, you can say, here’s my actual words that I transcribed.

Allie Chandler 00:14:42 Here’s my voice doc that I’ve painstakingly created and given examples, and you can at least get a draft. That way if you’re feeling stuck, because I think then you’re marrying how you speak in real life. Obviously that’s not going to be like a polished version that you would put right onto social, and then you’re massaging it into this. How does this avatar speak? What are some of the words that a mystic cosmic would use? What’s important to them? You can write down even frameworks that you believe in, like I love eMDR or I love EFT, and I want to kind of work that stuff into my copy. So I think a lot of it is there’s a lot of building to do on the front end of getting clear on everything, and then once you have that rolling, I think you can do a lot with the voice notes. And just like understanding your own voice and how you speak. It’s actually funny. So I’m working with Karen Krishnan and I’m helping him develop his brand right now.

Allie Chandler 00:15:37 And we had an email team that we were working with, but it sounded nothing like Karen. I have spent many years working under him, so we took a bunch of transcripts of his and we ran it through Claude and we said, hey, pull out some of the Karen ism. What does he say? What does he do repetitively? That sound like his voice? So if you’re someone that’s recorded like webinars or of course, content, you can do that for yourself. You can run those transcripts through AI and say, hey, make a voice stock of little mannerisms that I do or things that I’m like, how I’m sentence structuring everything that I’m saying. So there’s a couple little tips of ways to get clearer on it that can save you time and just give you a little bit more direction.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:16:20 That’s perfect, because that’s exactly what we teach in our perimenopause and menopause certificate and also our membership program, because I agree with you that AI can be valuable for massaging taking information, but you can’t really start there.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:16:35 You have to start with your own voice. And I love that tip of 100 voice memos, because it helps capture just a lot of data about how you actually normally speak in real life. So like you said, it doesn’t end up sounding weird. Like you get all these emails from someone signed Quran, but you’re like, I’ve met him in real life and that’s not him. Yeah.

Allie Chandler 00:16:58 True. It’s so true. I think while you’re driving, I mean, I know, like I said, time is usually a constraint for people, but I try to walk my dog every day. So I’ll grab three questions I want to answer. And I’m just taking my dog on a 45 minute walk. And I’m creating these voice notes. So I think a lot of us have to think about multitasking just to fit everything in a day. Because I know ideally, if we all had the time, we could sit down and complete all of these or write all of the captions and emails ourselves, but we just don’t have the time to do that, so it’s fitting it in with your already a very busy day.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:17:31 Absolutely. So when you when we get our clients more comfortable with their archetype or some combination of a couple of the archetypes and how they actually talk, by just practicing all these voice memos and then clarity on their avatar of who they’re helping. How does that better communication. And then, like I said, we teach cloud projects. We help you massage that together, and you can do the same thing in your work and take some of the load, because I think for some people, even just doing that is a little bit overwhelming. So having someone take it and run with it and get it done, because I even though I know how to build a lot of this stuff, we still have a social media team. I think it’s valuable to hire people to execute.

Allie Chandler 00:18:13 Absolutely.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:18:14 How does that better communication and aligned messaging actually improve their health care outcomes, not just improve their marketing?

Allie Chandler 00:18:25 Yeah, I guess I’ve noticed with practitioners I’ve done this with, we will experiment sometimes with a couple of different avatars.

Allie Chandler 00:18:33 And so what we’re typically doing is I love the model of a free masterclass getting people to sign up for a masterclass. Maybe you’re having it be an affiliate model where you’re partnering with people who are complimentary but not competitive to you necessarily, so they’re inviting their list to that as far as lead generation, but we’ll take them through a typical masterclass funnel where there’s an offer at the end, maybe it’s a tripwire, then we’re upselling them in the email series. And it’s interesting because I would say you may have to experiment a little bit because there have been a couple of offers I thought would be a home run for clients, and then it’s nobody cares about sinus things is what we learn. Same model, same format, for example. But I think what you’ll find is you’ll have better qualified leads that are more willing to work with you to make purchases to interact with you. I would rather have 100 leads that are highly qualified. They’re exactly my avatar that I’m looking for, and they’re probably going to convert then to have sort of these vanity metrics of, oh, in this masterclass we got 5000 leads, but our conversions 0.02%.

Allie Chandler 00:19:43 Obviously, we don’t want leads just for the sake of having leads. So I think that’s something that’s a little more difficult for people to wrap their heads around, because more is usually better when it comes to leads, but I don’t agree with that. I would rather keep honing the messaging as you’re communicating better and understanding your avatar and the offer and what their pain points are, you’re going to maybe dip and you’re going to you’re going to eliminate some people, right? You’re going to eliminate people that are like, that’s not me. You’re not speaking to me. I’m not a woman who’s in my 40s who’s dealing with hormones or whatever the case may be. And I think that’s totally fine as long as you’re clear on your messaging. So what we’ve found. Tracking all of the data like conversions and email, open rates and things like that. You can create a beautiful dashboard and just keep track of that, because then you can look at it and say, okay, my open rates for this whole masterclass series are pretty low.

Allie Chandler 00:20:42 Is it the copy? Is it the topic you can really hone down on what you think you need to revise for next time? And I think that’s really valuable. So yeah, typically you’re just getting more qualified leads who are ready to work with you. You’re spending less time convincing them because you’ve done that on the front end by being really clear on your avatar. So I think it’s great because if you have a coaching program, for example, people are going to come in and they’re probably going to be high retention because you’ve called out to them, you’re like, hey, this is your problem. I see you, I hear you, here’s how I can solve it and work alongside you. And they’re going to just feel like, oh my gosh, maybe for the first time somebody has seen me and understands the problem that I’m facing. And they’re probably going to be a longer term client. So one of the issues that I run into is we have maybe an offer or two, we have a tripwire for $17, and then maybe we have a course that we’ve created for, I don’t know, 297397 but then people want to keep going.

Allie Chandler 00:21:44 So in a couple of cases I’m like, it’s almost like our offer was too good that we weren’t ready for the next step, which would be like a higher ticket offer, a coaching program one on one, or maybe a membership. So in some cases, it’s keep thinking ahead as you’re going through these steps. Because when you’re calling out to these avatars and potential patients, they’re going to want to stay with you. And they’re going to some of them are going to want to keep consuming everything that you do. So keep thinking, what’s the next step in this funnel? And I think that’s maybe where some people get stuck, but it’s okay if you keep them on your list and you keep nurturing them while you’re figuring that out. So don’t let that stop you from taking the steps. But just something to keep in the back of your head is like, okay, after we do this master class and sell them this, what do we want to do next?

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:22:31 Yeah, I think that’s really important.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:22:33 And I think how that specifically relates to outcomes. When your own story, you talked about how it took you about a decade to fully recover, and maybe there were some places we could shorten that. Right. Like maybe quicker time to diagnosis, maybe better support up front. Maybe for some people it would have been better if you could have taken six months or a year off of work, if at all possible. That’s often not possible for our clients, but sometimes it can be. So there might have been a way to make that five years instead of ten years, but it was never going to be six months, right? Because there was a lot going on. So if you have the marketing systems to attract the people that are ready, as you said, to start with maybe three months and get a little improvement. Build trust. But then over time you develop this relationship. That’s what’s going to actually get them. The better outcomes is their knowing. And then if you have only people like that, you have people that are somewhat homogeneous.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:23:36 You actually get practiced in a very specific sub niche. And you see the little shift. Like just yesterday I was interviewing a colleague. And we work with this in our practice where the standard menopause dose of hormone therapy works quite well for people in a pretty narrow window, like people who have no other comorbidities. They’re a certain age, they have certain symptoms. That standard kind of FDA approved approach to menopause care works great, but 87% of the time it doesn’t because somebody has Lyme and MCAS and they just had a baby at 46. And so when you have more and more of that sliver, then you get good at it. Like you start to see, oh, for example, in our work, like, oh, instead of jumping right to 100mg of progesterone, let’s start with 50 and let’s do it after we do these three things and we change their diet in this way or we do that. So you’re working with people that a lot of them have Lyme or a lot of them have mold issues.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:24:44 And so you actually get more honed because you have a hundred people now in your practice that look like you and you have this confidence, but you also know how to develop the programs because it’s not going to take them three months or six months, like someone who’s perfectly healthy, but maybe just trying to lose 5 or £10 for an event. It’s just a totally different group of people. So I really love that because I think that’s how practitioners can feel more motivated to participate. It does take some work to work with you, and some people like you to really get clear on that messaging. It’s just as much of a commitment as their commitment to learning the tools and skills of healing.

Allie Chandler 00:25:31 Yeah, and I would say one of my more advanced skills that I love teaching is within your welcome series. If you can sit down and you can identify different, like you were saying, different little, it’s almost like you’re doing case studies, like you have these people, all these hundred people are this age and have Lyme or whatever the case may be.

Allie Chandler 00:25:54 Then what I love teaching people is we’ll split our avatars in this welcome series, and one of the first emails will say something like, hey, click on the button that is most like you, okay, I’m this age, I have this issue, I have this other comorbidity, or I just want to lose 5 or £10. Like you said, we can set maybe five of these in the welcome series and in most ISPs, which is where your emails go out, you’ll be able to do a click to tag. So I love and this is a bit of work, which is why I say it’s an advanced practice, but I love doing that on the front end. So one, I can see if 80% of my people are clicking the same button. That’s a great idea for me to know. Okay, maybe this is a signature program later on because most of my leads coming in. This is their main pain point. But the other thing you can do is on your segmenting your list on the front end.

Allie Chandler 00:26:48 So a lot of problems I see that practitioners face are they have one newsletter. They’ve never segmented anything, so they don’t know who’s like that. I want to lose £10 person or who’s this like severe Lyme mold, everything like chronic person. So they can’t actually change their messaging according to their audience. So that’s something that you can think about building in early on into a welcome series. And I always say we want to be able to provide you the information you need. So just click one of these, I create a quick little landing page. Hey thank you. Like you’ve opted in to receive information about whatever the case may be that they clicked on. But I think that’s really nice to know if you’re just starting out or if you’re like, okay, I want to go back and segment my list better. Throw that in your welcome series, and then you can get a lot of Intel about your offers from it. You can also understand your audience more and you can change your messaging. If you had an email marketing person full time, you can have different segments going out.

Allie Chandler 00:27:51 And then eventually when you grow your list, you can do a masterclass. That’s just specifically for those. I want to lose 5 to £10 people. You send it just to that segment. It’s the same thing we’ve been talking about is you’re going to have less people join, but you know, those people are your ideal audience for that masterclass. So I think that’s another kind of more later down the line thing that you can think about doing within your ESP.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:28:16 I love that. Yes. Really valuable. So many of the practitioners in our community have one off or small brick and mortar practices. Their physical therapists, their acupuncturists, their chiropractors, their midwives, and even we have some breast cancer surgeons. And what we’re seeing is there’s such a revolution in healthcare in general and in women’s health. And this has been happening for several decades, but it’s really accelerating now. Just a couple of episodes ago, we talked about the integration of AI and telehealth and how that’s really changing healthcare. So if you’re working with someone, you’ve worked with a lot of practitioners who transitioned from that kind of classic brick and mortar practice model to being more online and more global, which of course enhances your reach.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:29:07 So even if you have a super, super narrow reach niche, you can reach people all over the world in that niche. What are some of your just key shifts that you recommend practitioners make when they’re thinking about pivoting, or even adding more of a hybrid option in their practice?

Allie Chandler 00:29:26 That’s almost every practitioner I work with starts in a brick and mortar. They’ve been there for ten years, 15 years, and they’re like, I need to get out of the day to day. I’m tired. I want to start building my brand online. So that’s almost 100% of the people I’m working with. I would say typically there’s two things that I like to start with. Number one is let’s look at your website and all of your assets and see if you have enough reason for people to join your email list. So a lot of times there’s not a lead magnet, which most of you know, but it’s just usually it’s like a quiz or a PDF or an e-book or something that you’re having. People give your give their email a name to get onto your email list.

Allie Chandler 00:30:10 So I would say when I’m starting with people, if they’ve been in the brick and mortar, they haven’t ever thought about that because they haven’t had to. So we’ll think about let’s get something on your site above the fold and the hero a reason for them to join. A lot of people will have join my newsletter, but there’s no incentive. So they’re not getting leads consistently. And so that’s probably step one is getting lead gen. And if they have social media we’ll throw it on there too. A lot of people I start with don’t have necessarily a big list, or they don’t really have a social following, and that’s totally fine. In that case, what I like to do is we identify some key partners, like I said, who are people that maybe are a little bit further along practitioners in the journey, or they’re brands that are super aligned, and I’ll do the partnership and affiliate outreach and say, hey, let’s talk about a co-hosted webinar or how do we help each other? You’ll have different strengths in some cases.

Allie Chandler 00:31:08 So they might have a big email list. You might have a big social following. So you’re thinking about let’s do an Instagram Live, let’s collab on that. And then if you could send this email for me, like it’s a lot of kind of back and forth to create partnerships. But I do think that my biggest thing for these people, one is the lead magnet too, is how do we now continue building our email list? Because to me, that’s the best place to sell. It’s you’re going to always own it. I know there are a few people who have lost access to their Instagrams because of FDA or regulatory issues, or something happened where they got hacked. So I always say email list is the safest socials. Great. And there’s a lot you can do on social, but we’re typically starting with building that email list. And that’s in most cases it’s offering a lot of content building that trust because as we all know, people need to know, like and trust you in order to buy from you.

Allie Chandler 00:32:05 So I’m a very content and education forward marketer. I like to call my form of marketing empathy lead marketing. It’s just a little term that I made up, but I think when we’re working, especially with chronic illness people, they don’t want that direct sales like car salesman type of urgency marketing because they’re nervous systems are already overwhelmed and dysregulated, probably. So we approach things in a way that’s, hey, let me give you value, let me give you this lead magnet or this quiz. I will say the best conversions I’ve found are self-assessments. Hey, do you need help supporting your hormones? If you’re 45 and up, take this self-assessment five minutes and you’ll have a result or something. And then you can sell them something if you want to. But also people I think still are really liking short guides or checklists. I think ebooks can be good too, but I know I’ve played around with different models and I do think self-assessments and quizzes. People love hearing more information about themselves, so if you can coin some kind of terms around something, or if you can create something like that, I think that’s really helpful.

Allie Chandler 00:33:16 But yeah, it’s very normal if you’re trying to switch from brick and mortar to not have a following, not have an email list, I wouldn’t be super stressed about that. You just have to be a little strategic about how you’re going to build that.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:33:27 This episode has been chock full of valuable tips. I really appreciate it. Anything else you’d like to share with our community? Before we wrap up today.

Allie Chandler 00:33:36 I would say the thing that’s on my mind the most right now, especially for practitioners, is nervous system regulation. Because even us as clinicians, we have to be able to show up to these patient meetings and and even internal meetings with our team. And we have to be in this calm and grounded space. And so I’ve been looking into a lot more, even for myself, of what am I doing as a practice to be able to show up, because I have like eight people on my team, on my agency, and there’s a lot going on right now. So how do I show up to these team calls when we have apps that are coming out and like big launches and all webinars and things? How do I show up being the best version of myself so that I can give back to my team? So that’s just another point.

Allie Chandler 00:34:29 And I’ve been actually loving doing eMDR and tapping for myself. I think eMDR is a lot longer of a term. Obviously. I’ve been working with someone for a couple of years on that, but even just tapping for like acute stress, like I’ll just do a little round of the little hole. I’m sure everyone’s familiar with it, but yeah, different things like that. I’m just trying to learn how to best show up for myself and my team. And I have found that in doing so, I’m actually a lot more productive. My team doesn’t feel stressed because I’m not putting the stress on everyone else, and they’re actually able to produce more content because I’m able to show up being regulated. So that’s just another little piece, and especially with how stressful a lot of things in the world feel right now, I feel like we have even more of a responsibility to just like, self-care ourselves and take care of our own nervous system. So that’s the only last piece that I just wanted to share is if you’re a practitioner and you’re feeling the weight of everything and the stress and you’re responsible for everything in your business, just know that it’s okay to pour that time into yourself.

Allie Chandler 00:35:34 And sometimes you have to book it in your calendar. Like sometimes I’ll say, please don’t book any calls in these two hours. I need to go for a walk. I need like this morning I got up. I usually go Lyft six days a week and my body today was like, we’re just not. It’s not the day for it. So yeah, I did an hour and 15 minutes of yoga and I feel great. So it’s just listening to yourself and blocking off that time and knowing that it’s okay to do that.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:36:01 Absolutely. And I think as practitioners take responsibility for that nervous system regulation. By the way, I probably should have just Ortner on the podcast. I do love all the right, but we have tons of tools. Our students have learned tons of tools. Our community have learned tons of tools. We teach a lot about nervous system regulation, our courses, and I think that practice of it right. We were we had a retreat in Italy two summers ago and we were talking we did a whole breathwork session, and we were talking about each and every practitioner who was in that breathwork session already knew how to do it, knew it intellectually, knew the theory behind it.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:36:36 0% were doing it every day. That’s all I we’re just the cobbler. Whatever. The cobbler’s children have no shoes, all of that. But I do think that is so important, because if I show up for a call like that, for a podcast episode for a call with one of my clients for a masterclass, a webinar, a social media post. Like your energy comes with you, and if that energy is stressed or frenetic and not centered and regulated, people actually don’t know why. But they don’t really want to work with you because it’s kind of scary to be in your presence. So I think that’s such an important point. Thank you for sharing that.

Allie Chandler 00:37:22 And I do think you will.

Allie Chandler 00:37:23 Attract better clients, higher quality clients, better partnerships and things like that. It’s your energy is so important and how you show up. And I think you’ll.

Allie Chandler 00:37:34 See.

Allie Chandler 00:37:34 The great parts of that. If you really can invest a little bit of time in yourself.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:37:38 Absolutely. Thank you so much for all of this.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:37:42 I really appreciate you coming on and let everyone know where they can find you.

Allie Chandler 00:37:47 Yeah.

Allie Chandler 00:37:48 So the best place to go is. Uppsala. So you can take we have a practitioner archetype. We do have a patient one. But you can take that quiz if you want, like five minutes, like a little personality test you can take as a practitioner to understand which type of practitioner you are. And from there we’re actually launching an app soon that will be able to match you with brands and patients that are super aligned with your philosophy on healing and everything that you’re doing, and also the root causes that you work with. So like I said, when I was sick, I was really stressed about finding someone to work with that could help me heal. So now that I’m feeling better, I’m hoping that this app can help close that gap of patients finding you, finding the right person. And so if you take the quiz, you’ll be on our list to find out when our app launch should be in October this year.

Allie Chandler 00:38:42 But yes, upsell archetype. Just take the quiz and that’s your first step.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:38:46 Thank you so much. Thanks everyone for being here and we’ll see you soon. I loved that conversation with Ali. I hope you were taking notes. If not, go back and listen to that again and take notes. Especially if you’re a practitioner who feels a little stuck like you’re not. You don’t have the numbers of clients that you need to have a successful and profitable practice. If you feel nervous about getting out there and sharing your message, if you don’t even know how to develop your message like there are gems upon gems in that conversation, and your only homework for this week from that conversation is to go to upsell health archetype and just get curious how do you want to be perceived? What is your voice start? You know, recording voice notes or recording yourself doing educational talks, webinars, quick Instagram Reels, whatever feels easiest to you. Start speaking in your real voice in a way that’s aligned with what your clients are looking for and need from you.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:40:04 Go take the quiz and I will see you here, right back here next week.

Dr. Jessica Drummond 00:40:13 Thank you so much for joining me today for this episode of the Integrative Women’s Health Podcast. Please share this episode with a colleague and if you loved it, hit that subscribe or follow button on your favorite podcast streaming service so that we can do even more to make this podcast better for you and your clients. Let’s innovate and integrate in the world of women’s health.